Supernatural Problems

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Supernatural Problems

Postby Hellequin » Sat Oct 29, 2005 9:31 am

Ok, here is the question:

Don´t you think that some powers are underpowered while there are others overpowered? For an example, get the cure powers: hey, thats four feats just to get a guy able the cure the party! Don´t you think that a power only to cure posions is to much? This couldn´t be done with a higher difficulty?
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Re: Supernatural Problems

Postby timemrick » Sat Oct 29, 2005 3:43 pm

Hellequin wrote:Don´t you think that some powers are underpowered while there are others overpowered? For an example, get the cure powers: hey, thats four feats just to get a guy able the cure the party! Don´t you think that a power only to cure posions is to much? This couldn´t be done with a higher difficulty?

Combat plays a big part in d20, so curative powers do, too, and they justifiably require a large investment to master (several levels of cleric or druid in order to cure damage, blindness/deafness, disease, AND poison). I don't really see why that should be different in True20--combat is still a big part of the game.

Don't forget that you can spend a point of Conviction to gain use of a feat you don't have for one round, as long as you have all its prerequisites. That means that any adept can use cure powers in a pinch. If you don't expect to need some of them regularly, spend Conviction when you do, and spend your feats elsewhere. But if you're frequently facing a certain danger, take the related feat and save your Conviction.
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Re: Supernatural Problems

Postby Nomad4life » Sun Oct 30, 2005 5:34 am

timemrick wrote:
Don't forget that you can spend a point of Conviction to gain use of a feat you don't have for one round, as long as you have all its prerequisites. That means that any adept can use cure powers in a pinch.


Wow. What an excellent point!
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Postby Hellequin » Sun Oct 30, 2005 11:02 am

"Don't forget that you can spend a point of Conviction to gain use of a feat you don't have for one round, as long as you have all its prerequisites. That means that any adept can use cure powers in a pinch."

Ok, very very good point. Now I will shut up! :)

"PS. Hey Hellequin, how much True20 is being played in Brazil?"

Actually, not much. There is only a few guys in the whole country playing it. There are few players in Brazil that use the internet/forums to talk about the RPG (and the few that do this, talk a lot more about d20 and ST - and other few nacional systems such Opera). You know, there is a lot of players that really dont speak English. But, well, I am translating a few True20 resume to post on 'my' fórum (www.rpg.com.br/forums - my nick there is Roquen).

"Ever planning to visit Montevideo? If so, let me know!"

No and yes!!! I have never left Brazil but I live really close to Uruguai (I live in the south of Brazil, in Rio Grande do Sul). I think you know it!

:)

Well, sorry for the bad english (hey, I am not use to write in English!).

Abraços.
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Re: Supernatural Problems

Postby reverend keith » Mon Oct 31, 2005 11:36 am

timemrick wrote:
Hellequin wrote:Don´t you think that some powers are underpowered while there are others overpowered? For an example, get the cure powers: hey, thats four feats just to get a guy able the cure the party! Don´t you think that a power only to cure posions is to much? This couldn´t be done with a higher difficulty?

Don't forget that you can spend a point of Conviction to gain use of a feat you don't have for one round, as long as you have all its prerequisites. That means that any adept can use cure powers in a pinch. If you don't expect to need some of them regularly, spend Conviction when you do, and spend your feats elsewhere. But if you're frequently facing a certain danger, take the related feat and save your Conviction.

Remember, depending on your narrator and your natures, Conviction is a very finite resource. If you end up in a game where you use a power more than once or twice (Cure in a combat-driven game, Truth-Reading in a diplomacy-focused game), it's very dangerous to rely on Conviction. Also, you need Conviction for rerolling poor rolls or even survive combat. If you are in a game that has combat in any real frequency, one of the PCs should really invest in Cure, because everyone will be using that conviction to hit or to succeed in Toughness rolls.

As to the original point, I don't believe that all powers are equal. Example #1: Bliss (incap target for 1 round+) and Sleep (incap target for 1 minute+). Example #2: Cold Shaping allows you to inflict direct damage, Fire Shaping does not.

Of course, if you really wanted to it wouldn't be difficult to fold a number of powers together (say, Cure, Cure Disease, Cure Blindness/Deafness, Cure Poison, and Imbue Life) into one power (say, Healing) and then assign each power a particular DC. Most likely restoring life will be a higher DC than curing diseases, which may by higher than curing poisons, and the default power being Cure. Putting multiple powers into one feat has it's drawbacks, but it could work, depending on the campaign.
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Postby Warbringer » Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:01 pm

Don't forget that in True20 you gain a feat at every level, so you can gain those powers quickly.

Indeed, an adept could be a healer at first level with all four feats.
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Postby aaronil » Fri Nov 04, 2005 11:50 am

On a related note, does anyone else see a problem with allowing an Adept access to any power (as long as prereqs. are met) by spending a Conviction point?

I would much rather see a supernatural feat "Supernatural Exertion" which allows an Adept to choose 3 powers. From then on, the adept can spend a Conviction point to use any one of those three powers.

I think this would retain some power for an adept, while not allowing genre/concept breaking possibilities.
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Postby Grim Luck » Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:34 am

I don't feel requiring an adept to take a feat to have access to conviction based powers is a good sell to most Adept players. It might appeal to some, depending on the answers to the following question.

Q. If I have the "Supernatural Exertion" feat, and then at another level I learn one of the magical effects that I previously only knew through "Supernatural Exertion" would I then be left with only 2 powers I could use through supernatural exertion?

If so, then when I learned all three of those powers, it would be a wasted feat slot.

Our group doesn't follow the typical D20 oriented leveling. What I mean is, we start at about 6th level, and over the course of a campaign might level 2 or 3 times. Our idea is to create a character that is ready to go and play it. I know that traditional role play means starting when your character is pathetic and working it up to godhood, but that doesn't appeal to our players. We like more realistic 'role-play' over 'roll-play'. Not that I'm knocking the other type of game play. It just isn't for our group. The point I'm getting at is that our group play has a little less of a problem with greater flexibility at the cost of expending a point of conviction. I'm not sure if others feel this way, but I wanted to put down our stance.
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Postby Warbringer » Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:13 pm

It is a powerful use of conviction.

If you wanted to control the use you could attach special circumstances to recovery conviction spent in this way; a purifcation ritual or such. Or, you might deem that the "power" came from aid granted by a third party, a coven, a master or a demon power.

Regaining conviction from these sources would also be coupled with the adept becoming indebted.
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Postby Hellequin » Mon Nov 21, 2005 7:31 pm

As to the original point, I don't believe that all powers are equal. Example #1: Bliss (incap target for 1 round+) and Sleep (incap target for 1 minute+). Example #2: Cold Shaping allows you to inflict direct damage, Fire Shaping does not.

And how this problem could be solved? I mean: balance between all the powers would be a nice thing, don´t you think? Another power that is bothering is Calm: if we had Heart Shaping, why the hell do I need Calm? Enhance Self and Enhance Other? My problem with putting all this powers together: there wouldn´t be to few powers in the end of the job? This wouldn´t allow that adept take almost all the powers?

And here is another thing: does anyone have a Curse Power? I mean, a power that allow you to split some curses around ...

Thanks!

(obs.: sorry for the delay in the answer)
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