Armor

[Azai]

So I have been making a list of all the npcs that have been stated out, and one thing I keep noticing is how many characters have "superior" plate mail. Or "well made" plate.

Now is this just for famous characters? Or are their rules that apply(Just like weapons) to armor in the game? As in dropping AP and such.

[coldwind]

There are no official rules, but extrapolation shows that they're usually just +1 AR, a reduction of 1 to the AP, or Bulk -1 vs the normal versions of the armors.

They're essentially the armor version of superior and extraordinary weapons.

[Azai]

That's what I was thinking. I like the idea and I don't like the idea at the same time.

It's weird.

[Jon Snow]

Maybe Joe will stop by and clarify, but I think I recall him saying he was removing those from the new edition of the campaign guide.

[Kival]

Yep, but I'll not follow that lead though . Especially full plate armour allows for some nice degree of improvement. There should perhaps not be a "valyrian steel" level of weapon but at least a superior armour is quite doable in my regard.

[Carriker]

Maybe Joe will stop by and clarify, but I think I recall him saying he was removing those from the new edition of the campaign guide.

I am indeed, but only because we didn't have the space in either the GoT-edition corebook or Campaign Guide to give a full set of rules for those traits.

Doing a Chronicle System PDF with rules on higher-quality types armor is definitely on my To Do List.

[Kajani]

We used a house rule, that there are superior armor (pricex2) which gives you AP or Bulk 1 point better than the normal armor suit...
I think this is balanced, not so good as some of the (not very consistent examples) in the campaign guide

[Lord Ben]

We used a house rule, that there are superior armor (pricex2) which gives you AP or Bulk 1 point better than the normal armor suit...
I think this is balanced, not so good as some of the (not very consistent examples) in the campaign guide

It can get messed up with Acrobatic Defense + Armor Mastery when you're doing flips and cartwheels, etc in a breastplate and CD18 with a greatsword when you're able to reduce bulk by 2 but other than that it's pretty balanced movement wise.

[Azai]

On that note, is Armor Master suppose to reduce your armor penalty in some way? Or just improve your armor rating and take away some bulk?

[Zorbeltuss]

the latter.

[Ich]

I'm not looking at my PE atm, so my exact word use may be a bit off, but is it still true in the GoT edition that you can gain a point of Fatigue to ignore armor penalties for one turn?

Edit: Having purchased the GoT edition, I can answer that in the affirmative. Never really expected otherwise, but this fine rule really fixes any problems with armor, IMO.

[davepark]

How to improve the armor rating?

[Paedrig]

Until now i did not know how to get a AR improvement. Some might use house rules for superior armor which did not reduce the AP or Bulk but give a better AR.
And there is of course the possibility to use optional rules for the combination of different armor types. But this is tricky, you must always consider what is possible´/ plausible and the fact that some armor types (brigandine, plate and - at least in reality - also mail IS already a combination of the 'main' armor plus padded armor).
I. m. O. it is most time the better idea to simply use annother type of armor...

[Zorbeltuss]

armor mastery benefits increases AR.

[Paedrig]

Yeah, you are right. I thought the question was ment for an AR increasement because of the quality/ material of the ARMOR...

[Kival]

I houseruled armors:

Castle-steel get's +1 Armor
Extraordinarie Armor ghet's the +1 Armor and -1 Bulk and -1 AP.
Some armors may even get additional bonii. Bronze Yohn's armor received an additional Bulk-reduction.

And Armor specialtiey will not increase AR, that always seemed strange to me, but allow for a Bulk reduction for level 1 and an AP reduction for level 2 (or something similar, had not to decide on this so far).

[Paedrig]

Your extraordinary armor is very good. Perhaps even a little too good.
Of course if such armor is as rare as valyrian steel it might be o. k., but still...

[muggie2]

I houseruled armors:

Castle-steel get's +1 Armor
Extraordinarie Armor ghet's the +1 Armor and -1 Bulk and -1 AP.
Some armors may even get additional bonii. Bronze Yohn's armor received an additional Bulk-reduction.

And Armor specialtiey will not increase AR, that always seemed strange to me, but allow for a Bulk reduction for level 1 and an AP reduction for level 2 (or something similar, had not to decide on this so far).

Ouch, that does make extraordinary armor well and truly extraordinary! Perhaps a little too much.
When discussing with the others in my gaming group(s), we gave it +1 Armor and -1 Bulk. And even then, it was heirloom type equipment, something nobody knew how to make over here, and only worked if you could make up a darn good story and background for how you/your family got their hands on it, a story that the GM could use.

[Kival]

It's not as rare as Valyrian steel (or if there really are 100, actually the armour might be more rare...). Mastersmith still know how to make these kind of armour but only few have armours which are that expensive. The Kingsguard and the King usually have these kind of armour and families like the Lannisters or the Tyrells (e.g. Loras Tyells armour I consider extraordinarie). Extraordinarie armour does only exist of Plate-type of armours though.

No player character has such tremendous armour though and it will be as rare for them as a Valyrian sword. Even if you have enough money to make such an armour, most masterwork Smith will only make them for the highest nobility (or the greatest "heroes"). If any player would want it from the start, I'd only allow it by a similar rule as Valyrian Swords. Valyrian weapons are more than just extraordinaire though, they have additional qualities as discussed in one of the other threads here (which was not very relevant in my chronic so far, though).

[Paedrig]

Hmm...I always thought that giving "castle forged" armor (NOT of valyrian steel) a one point lower AP OR Bulk might be enough.
In combination with the fact that we generally reduced the AP of half/ full plate armor by one (this type of armor was after all the high end of medival armor and the stats of plate armor in the core rule book are real bad) this is enough i think...
But a better AR, AP AND Bulk... (and not because such excotic material like valyrian steel or - f. e. - some spells or magic runes etc...)

[Kival]

Hmm...I always thought that giving "castle forged" armor (NOT of valyrian steel) a one point lower AP OR Bulk might be enough.

Although Bulk-reduction makes sense realistically, I don't think it's even remotely close in effectiveness as AP-reduction.

In combination with the fact that we generally reduced the AP of half/ full plate armor by one (this type of armor was after all the high end of medival armor and the stats of plate armor in the core rule book are real bad) this is enough i think...

I don't think Westeros plate armour is already so well developed. I actually think they are still using Platearmour with mail to cover the gaps instead of 15th/16th century "pure" plate armours. But I think I improved Platearmour (and Mailarmour which seemed to be very underrated in the system, too). Remember though that the transition from Mail to Breastplate was not so much because of better protection but because the new techniques allowed for cheaper and easier repairable armors. (That does of course not apply to full-plate, which had to be made individually for every Knight).

But a better AR, AP AND Bulk... (and not because such excotic material like valyrian steel or - f. e. - some spells or magic runes etc...)

I don't see a problem. Castle-Forged armour is just made out of better quality steel that's why it get's +1 AR. Really good armorsmith can make a really good armor for very rich and important individuals which allows them an additional -1 AP and -1 Bulk. You could make it -1AP OR -1 Bulk but I really don't think that's necessary. Why should there be only one level of improved Armor? Another possibility would be:

Castle forged armor allows für +1 AR or -1 Bulk (either same weight but better protection or less weight but still same protection)
Extraordinarie allows one of the Castle-forged boni AND an AP-reduction of 1.

But nearly everyone mechanical wise would opt for +AR and -1AP reduction then. And I don't think that the additional Bulk-reduction would hurt.

[Paedrig]

Concerning your interpretation of Westeros plate armor i am not so certain.
The description of armor in the books differ. In the core rule book there is said that full plate MIGHT include a skirt of mail - this sounds to me more like plate armor of the 15th century, not the type of plate/mail-combination that you are talking about. It is also said that the tech level of Westeros is roughly similar to medieval europa between the 13th and 15th century (with some exceptions and without gunpowder)
But the description of Bronns opponent at the Erye (and also something said in the campaign guide) went more in your way.
Plus there is mentioned a type of "plate and mail armor" in the campaign guide (stats of splint armor) - perhaps an attempt to put some sort of armor you mentioned into the game?
On the other hand the art of armor forging that is mentioned at different places in Martins and the rpg books sounds very elaborate for me - more like the (very skillfully made) armors of the 16th century...
The picture they use in the books and adventures etc. are inconsistent too and range from armors that look like the 11th (or even 8th) century up to armor of late medieval or even later times...

You can choose what you like - or say, that all of thus types of armor exists - the more elaborate types of plate armor in the more cultivated areas (Kings Landing, the Westlands, the Reach etc.), and the older types at such places like the north, the stormlands etc...

After all the brigandine that is mentioned in the core rule books was (as far as i know) also a armor of the 14th/15th century...